OAUA & Hacking

[hans]

Sorry, I actually meant "event conditions" not "events" in my quote above.  AFAIK, kailung isn't needed for the new events like Macho, Do Good etc. but it's the event conditions I worry about. Have you made use of them, too? E.g. if I want to check if a sohei is in the party, is it safe to set that condition in the editor or should I use kailung for it?

 

I think I used several event conditions, for giving and taking away special abilities, selecting a PC based on their specab, etc. 

[Darius]

I haven't quite grasped how to handle event conditions in OAUA. Should I use kailung for all of them, just in case, or are there some that are safe to use in the editor? Is it that kailung offers some that aren't available in the editor or are all event conditions available in the editor too but won't work correctly if I don't use kailung to set them?

Hi Olivier,
You must be reading the docs from an earlier version of the OA Worldhack.  We did initially have some difficulty with getting ckit to properly handle all of those new event conditions found in OAUA, but all of that was fixed in either version 1.2 or 1.3 of the Worldhack and the documentation notes were updated stating this.  As long as you are using the current version of OAUA (and reading those documentation notes), you don't need Kailung.

Kailung, by the way, is the OA version of Brian's Scruadat program.  I do still use it occasionally for the same purpose I use Scruadat in my non-OA designs, as a supplement to the UA editor to create event copies, event loops and common text so I can squeeze more out of my dungeons.  But it is certainly not required.

And to your other question, yes, I'm afraid the OA Worldhack is as good as it will get now that Brian is gone.  Bugs will need to be documented and work arounds discovered.  Since I do have several prior versions of the ckit hacks in diff.tbl format, there is still a possibility that I might be able to isolate a specific section of code that is causing problems and revert it back to an earlier version that was working properly, or even do an analysis of the code with a decompiler, but I honestly haven't the time to do such research right now, and it appears only four or five UA'ers (including myself) are even utilizing OAUA at this time.  Instead I'm using the scraps of available time I have now trying to finish up Part II of the Tale of Twin Dragons.

[hans]

...and it appears only four or five UA'ers (including myself) are even utilizing OAUA at this time. 

Judging from the slow output of mods, there may not be that many more regularly utilizing UA, itself, sad to say.   

Hopefully, a new boom of excitement and enthusiasm is just waiting to be sparked for both...   

Instead I'm using the scraps of available time I have now trying to finish up Part II of the Tale of Twin Dragons.

 

I'm really looking forward to that!   

[Ben J]

Judging from the slow output of mods, there may not be that many more regularly utilizing UA, itself, sad to say.   

Hopefully, a new boom of excitement and enthusiasm is just waiting to be sparked for both...   

Well, there was this really epic module that got released just this month...

And if Kaz-Keith and Darius and Ben S and you finish their announced modules, there's still a lot to look forward to for the community. 

[hans]

Well, there was this really epic module that got released just this month...

 

And I'm quite enjoying it, Ben!   

I haven't had a lot of UA time this last month, 'cuz my mom's had hip surgery (which has gone very well, btw).  What time I have had, lately, I've been playing your mod. 

I'm disappointed, however, that half this year has almost gone by, and I still have no ULs of my own to show for it.  Rocco Taku's SHUA experiment is going to take a good deal more time before it's finished.  And when I think that last year I ULed 3 mods...!   

[Ben J]

And I'm quite enjoying it, Ben!   

I haven't had a lot of UA time this last month, 'cuz my mom's had hip surgery (which has gone very well, btw).  What time I have had, lately, I've been playing your mod. 

Cool.    (That you're enjoying my game, not the thing with your mother. Glad to hear that she's well.)

Let me know what you thought when you're done. It's quite a long trip. I myself needed over three weeks for the final walkthrough.

I'm disappointed, however, that half this year has almost gone by, and I still have no ULs of my own to show for it.  Rocco Taku's SHUA experiment is going to take a good deal more time before it's finished.  And when I think that last year I ULed 3 mods...!   

Oh, I don't mind waiting a year for a new hans mod. 

[Olivier Leroux]

Hi Olivier,
You must be reading the docs from an earlier version of the OA Worldhack.  We did initially have some difficulty with getting ckit to properly handle all of those new event conditions found in OAUA, but all of that was fixed in either version 1.2 or 1.3 of the Worldhack and the documentation notes were updated stating this.  As long as you are using the current version of OAUA (and reading those documentation notes), you don't need Kailung.

Thanks for the clarification, Darius! Yeah, sorry, I just read the online version included in UANL #36 and didn't take into consideration that it isn't up to date anymore... 

And to your other question, yes, I'm afraid the OA Worldhack is as good as it will get now that Brian is gone.  Bugs will need to be documented and work arounds discovered.  Since I do have several prior versions of the ckit hacks in diff.tbl format, there is still a possibility that I might be able to isolate a specific section of code that is causing problems and revert it back to an earlier version that was working properly, or even do an analysis of the code with a decompiler, but I honestly haven't the time to do such research right now, and it appears only four or five UA'ers (including myself) are even utilizing OAUA at this time.  Instead I'm using the scraps of available time I have now trying to finish up Part II of the Tale of Twin Dragons.

Good to hear you're still working on Twin Dragons 2. 

I don't know if you already count me among the four or five UA'ers utilizing OAUA but for me sadly it's always been the bugs that scared me off once I'd acquired a taste for the setting... (And I guess it's possible that I scared off other designers myself by mentioning the bugs...  ). Maybe I should forget about releasing the perfect OAUA mod for now and instead just actively play around with it in order to get all those bugs documented, if there's still a chance someone might be able to fix them one day.

[Darius]

Hi Olivier,
I think any bugs that are left can fairly easily be avoided, and they certainly haven't stopped hans or me from releasing fully functional mods.  The only current bugs that I'm aware of that haven't been squashed are limited to the use of a couple of spells, the "whole party is healed" message in the Temple Fix menu, and potentially the Do Good event if you have an already dead PC.  In fact, these are so easily overlooked that I would not have known they existed unless they were brought to my attention.  I certainly wouldn't let any of them stop you from bringing to life your own OA creations.   

[Olivier Leroux]

Hm... I hope you're right. And do you have any idea what might have caused the graphical bug I posted a screenshot of here?

[Darius]

Hm... I hope you're right. And do you have any idea what might have caused the graphical bug I posted a screenshot of here?

I'm afraid not, and I was going to say I had never seen anything like that either, but I tried replicating it and I was indeed able to recreate it.  It seems to happen if you have an "open" wall (like a doorway) on the west side of your one square hut, and it doesn't seem to be specific to the dungeon art used.  I guess I'll have to add this to the list of known issues.  Again, if I had all the time in the world, I'd try testing the same thing on earlier versions of the OA Worldhack to see where it went wrong and then work to isolate the problem.  If there's anyone interested in undertaking such a project, please let me know!!

[hans]

Is it entirely a graphic (visual) bug?  That is, does the intended target still receive the damage of the attack, and the battle go on otherwise as normal?

(I'm not thinking that the stone wall is taking damage.) 

[Olivier Leroux]

No guarantees, I don't quite remember, but I think it was a normal combat otherwise. What you see in the screenshot wasn't caused by any attack or something, it just was there the way you see it, from the beginning of the combat to the end, independent of my PC's actions.

[hans]

Maybe we could just call that an Easter Egg, then?   

[Olivier Leroux]

Maybe we could just call that an Easter Egg, then?   

You mean an Eastern egg? 

[Darius]

Maybe we could just call that an Easter Egg, then?   

You mean an Eastern egg? 

HA!