Author Topic: Adapting some of the OAUA hacks for use with ordinary FRUA  (Read 187 times)

Offline steve_mcdee

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Adapting some of the OAUA hacks for use with ordinary FRUA
« on: April 13, 2017, 05:31:16 AM »
Although I have checked out a design or two made with it, I haven't previously had cause to use OAUA as a designer -- I don't have any particular interest in or knowledge of the oriental setting. I had not appreciated what impressive changes had been made to event triggers -- allowing any spell effect on the party  to trigger an event, allowing the presence of an NPC in the party to trigger an event, and checking for the race or class of the active character, for example.

My understanding is that these were implemented mainly by modifying the script.glb. I might be wrong, but my impression is that these are essentially things that the FRUA engine can basically handle, except that the default event menus do not provide the necessary options for the designer to select them.

I think some ckit hacking probably is also necessary but the good thing about that is, of course, that it is easy to duplicate in any design providing it is known which bytes to alter, and how, via a diff.tbl.

So ... I am wondering if it may be possible to implement these same effects, but without the OA-specific features such as the new class and race names.

Does anyone know if there are any fantasy-setting mods that utilise a modified script.glb that does these things?

Is there any appetite for an attempt to create a "standard fantasy"/"Forgotten Realms" version of script.glb that improves further upon the one in "bugfix1.zip"? That would be like FRUA v1.4.

I know Adam managed to achieve a kind of standalone version of the "NPC in party" trigger, but that hack also incidentally modified the event menu to refer to the OAUA classes and races. And, as explained in a separate thread, I experienced some problems with that screwing up other existing event triggers.

Offline Kaz-Keith

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Re: Adapting some of the OAUA hacks for use with ordinary FRUA
« Reply #1 on: April 13, 2017, 08:19:22 PM »
Although I have checked out a design or two made with it, I haven't previously had cause to use OAUA as a designer -- I don't have any particular interest in or knowledge of the oriental setting. I had not appreciated what impressive changes had been made to event triggers -- allowing any spell effect on the party  to trigger an event, allowing the presence of an NPC in the party to trigger an event, and checking for the race or class of the active character, for example.

My understanding is that these were implemented mainly by modifying the script.glb. I might be wrong, but my impression is that these are essentially things that the FRUA engine can basically handle, except that the default event menus do not provide the necessary options for the designer to select them.

I think some ckit hacking probably is also necessary but the good thing about that is, of course, that it is easy to duplicate in any design providing it is known which bytes to alter, and how, via a diff.tbl.

So ... I am wondering if it may be possible to implement these same effects, but without the OA-specific features such as the new class and race names.

Does anyone know if there are any fantasy-setting mods that utilise a modified script.glb that does these things?

Is there any appetite for an attempt to create a "standard fantasy"/"Forgotten Realms" version of script.glb that improves further upon the one in "bugfix1.zip"? That would be like FRUA v1.4.

I know Adam managed to achieve a kind of standalone version of the "NPC in party" trigger, but that hack also incidentally modified the event menu to refer to the OAUA classes and races. And, as explained in a separate thread, I experienced some problems with that screwing up other existing event triggers.

Hey Steve - I'm sure others are far more knowledgeable about the OA haks but I can agree and empathise with the ideas you presented.  OA, in particular, also utilises a fairly strong palette change which means importation of art would need to be colour-corrected which is something that was too daunting for myself to yet use.  Aside from OA, I've wanted to dip into both the Gamma World and Nol's EGA haks as well.  As of yet, there is no standard FR frua hak, though many of us design with FR in mind with regards to locale, monsters, npcs, etc.

The closest to what you are asking on, for Forgotten Realms, would be any generic FRUA campaign that you can then edit yourself to accommodate your needs.  This may or may not include spell, race, item editing so this may mean you challenging yourself by digging into said changes.  Luckily for us all there are some fine tutorials and editing programmes to work with.  Most recently, I worked with music hacking and direct diff.tbl file hacking, which basically involved opening the diff.tbl file in windows' notepad (or any basic doc editor) and writing or copy/pasting the edited lines in directly.  Many many FRUAites here post edit links as copy/paste-ready (Nol springs instantly to mind as he consistently offers changes he's worked with in such format in his posts, and Nologgie, who has regrettably been absent a while now), and several articles in the UANLs specifically break down diff.tbl and other file lines into editable understandability.

Try to tackle one subject at a time, until you feel comfortable to begin edit changes.  Post queries in the appropriate forum section and plenty of us would help however we are able to.  The diff.tbl will probably be the most challenging, and of course you will want to make certain you are backing up all files prior to engaging in your preliminary efforts.  The script.glb was a popular edit topic a while back, and much headway was made especially in the documentation of the base file format.  Some of the changes aren't easily explained or reproduced without further understanding of FRUA's structuring which is inconsistent at best.

Personally, I am most familiar with Ray Dyer's base Realm hak as it comes closest to what I would otherwise have attempted creating myself.

Statting creatures, art resources for FR, etc. are easiest to come by as I'm sure you are already aware of.

Offline steve_mcdee

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Re: Adapting some of the OAUA hacks for use with ordinary FRUA
« Reply #2 on: April 13, 2017, 09:03:17 PM »
Thanks Kaz. I have done some pretty extensive hacking to create my own version of a deagonlance campaign setting, including using many different hacking programs, and the UGE and direct diff.tbl editing.

I just hadn't realised until recently that it was possible to achieve the sorts of changes to the editor -- new event triggers and the like -- which OAUA implements. What is most important for my plans is to get the "NPC in Party" trigger working, without upsetting other useful triggers. I'm not clear on how much of that is achieved by script.glb and how much by ckit hacking; my understanding is that it requires a combination of the two.

Offline Kaz-Keith

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Re: Adapting some of the OAUA hacks for use with ordinary FRUA
« Reply #3 on: April 13, 2017, 09:44:28 PM »
Thanks Kaz. I have done some pretty extensive hacking to create my own version of a deagonlance campaign setting, including using many different hacking programs, and the UGE and direct diff.tbl editing.

I just hadn't realised until recently that it was possible to achieve the sorts of changes to the editor -- new event triggers and the like -- which OAUA implements. What is most important for my plans is to get the "NPC in Party" trigger working, without upsetting other useful triggers. I'm not clear on how much of that is achieved by script.glb and how much by ckit hacking; my understanding is that it requires a combination of the two.

Ah okay... yes, those event haks are part of the OA itself and were never developed or released outside of that project.  Sorting through UANLs 35, 36 and 37 can define the events and their individual parts/required input for placement.

I would suggest using the OA hak as a base and then developing -that- into your own personal hak with regards to being able to utilise the new events.  Brian perhaps left Darius with the latest working of his kailung.exe, which was an installer for the base hak, but he had mentioned development for individual event haks outside any worldhak on his personal website.  These, of course, have never been completed.  I do wonder tho if those individual script and specab files couldn't be overinstalled into a blank ua work to try and pin them to a new design instead of via OA... from everyone's wording (Brian's and Darius'), this is not the case... but?

Offline hans

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Re: Adapting some of the OAUA hacks for use with ordinary FRUA
« Reply #4 on: April 13, 2017, 10:51:03 PM »
This is from my first post in the OA -- Japanese to Chinese hack... thread (http://ua.reonis.com/index.php?topic=2286.0): 

The late Brian O'Donnell, God rest his soul, warned me that hacking OAUA's Ckit would probably wreck it, since the changes made to UA's coding were so extreme.  When I said that I was thinking of mostly just changing some names, like for classes and items, though, he thought that might work out okay. 


 :P

 

anything