Author Topic: art requests for Dinonykos  (Read 45408 times)

Offline manikus

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Re: art requests for Dinonykos
« Reply #480 on: August 14, 2017, 01:22:54 PM »
I was looking to see if you had created and posted a backdrop guide similar to your wall guide? Having one to help us mere mortals make backdrops that fit in with DC's interesting take on 1-point perspective.

Offline Dinonykos

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Re: art requests for Dinonykos
« Reply #481 on: August 14, 2017, 02:19:17 PM »
I will have a look later/tomorrow. (I am currently sitting at a different computer.)

The backgrounds with the diagonal plates by the way use only one perspective, not DC's/FRUA's mixture of one-point and isometric perspective. I tried this once and the result looked so strange that I never used it... :)
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Offline manikus

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Re: art requests for Dinonykos
« Reply #482 on: August 14, 2017, 03:10:40 PM »
I think we only need to worry about the DC/FRUA perspective if our lines are parallel to the walls, maybe just parallel to the side walls.

Offline Dinonykos

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Re: art requests for Dinonykos
« Reply #483 on: August 15, 2017, 03:40:55 AM »
These are grids/early stage images which may be useful as guides.
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Offline Dinonykos

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Re: art requests for Dinonykos
« Reply #484 on: August 15, 2017, 03:55:08 AM »
Two more "upgrades" (I hope Uatu forgives me using this term :) ) to walls made by Uatu.

I added a few more plants to Uatu's Taraxacum (dandelions) wall.
Uatu's oak did not show it's trunk in slots A and B, I am not sure if this is due to the way the wall generator handles it, but I think it iwas confusing.

There are generally two philosophies concerning slots A and B - concerning the perspectives, these slots should show more than half of the wall. This is how I handle it. Others (and I think also the wall generator) show only half of the wall in slot A and B. But as I saw in "Case of the stolen masterpiece", even if walls of both types are used together, it does not really jump into one's eye...

You can see the difference even in the examples below: If I had done the oak the way I would do it, the trunk would not be as close to the edge of the slot. Concerning the dandelions, I used my grid, thus you can see one more dandelion in slots A and B...
« Last Edit: August 15, 2017, 03:58:03 AM by Dinonykos »
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Offline Uatu

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Re: art requests for Dinonykos
« Reply #485 on: August 15, 2017, 09:45:47 AM »
Hmm - to be honest, I will have to spend some time comparing the D, etc. slots to see what I am doing wrong!  As for the tree, I actually did not use the generator that time (the wall is older than the generator), but maybe I misjudged the location of the tree for the A and B slots?  I thought that the trunks would be outside the PCs' line of sight...
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Offline Dinonykos

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Re: art requests for Dinonykos
« Reply #486 on: August 15, 2017, 11:13:15 AM »
Well, if the tree is standing in the center of the wall, then, with your approach (depicting half of the wall in slots A and B), you should at least see half of the trunk. With my approach, you would even see the complete trunk. For your Quercus robur, I used a kind of compromise... :)

Concerning slots D etc. - the thing is that these slots use a piece of the frontal view in the default wall template. But this is wrong, since a different vanishing point should be used.
By the way, I readily admit that many of my walls do not have correct perspectives (even considering DC's weird perspective mixture).
« Last Edit: August 15, 2017, 11:14:57 AM by Dinonykos »
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Offline manikus

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Re: art requests for Dinonykos
« Reply #487 on: August 15, 2017, 01:24:01 PM »
Thank you for the grids. :) Exactly what I was hoping for - I am needing to make some backdrops for the Hero Craft porject.

A & B philosophy:
There are actually 3 schools of thought. ;)
We can call them the Full Wall school, the Half Wall school, and the Dinonykosian Wall school (which is more than half, but less than full). Proponents of these schools are, respectively, Ziroc, manikus, and Dinonykos. The first and second schools do not work well together, but both work with the third school.
There are theoretical fourth and fifth schools (more than full and less than half), but one of them is silly and the other has only been tried in my head and would be something like 45% of the wall as opposed to a full half.

Offline Dinonykos

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Re: art requests for Dinonykos
« Reply #488 on: August 15, 2017, 02:18:08 PM »
You are certainly aware of it: By flipping the grid with the high ceiling, you have a low ground that might be useful for the rooftops... :)

Concerning the schools:
You could also call the "Dinonykosian Wall School" the "School of Consequent Perspective" :) (meaning that I use the same perspective ratios for all side walls).

But I can completely understand following the Half Wall School, because following its philosophy gives the feeling of standing right in the center of a square. 45% makes also sense in this context - with that, you have the feeling that you (or your party) stands just in front of the 3d view window. I like that idea... :)

The Full Wall School is not a nice approach in my opinion - it does not look convincing (the walls appear squeezed), and it would mean that the party is either invisible or standing with the back to the wall (if not inside the wall). Its advantage, though, is that you can see more of the room without turning the party.
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Offline manikus

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Re: art requests for Dinonykos
« Reply #489 on: August 15, 2017, 02:54:50 PM »
Yes to the rooftops. :D I don't know if I will od any for Hero Craft (I am for my own project, but different sized viewport that is also square)

Your way of doing the side walls looks good and is consistent. Both of these things is important.
I was thinking about the spot where the party is standing, and dis some number juggling and came up with the idea that the spot is somewhere between 46.6% and 50%. Actually, if just look at the square the part is in and not the other squares, the party may be some where between 54% and 56%. :D

Offline Dinonykos

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Re: art requests for Dinonykos
« Reply #490 on: August 16, 2017, 03:37:42 AM »
I made a few grids quickly to illustrate what we are discussing... :)

I thought the smaller 50% options over, I think with these, you cannot see enough of the square, and thin objects standin in the center of the square edges (like slencer NPCs or the trunk of Uatu's oak) would be outside the viewport, which might irritate players (at least me :) ).

I think the difference between the "perspective approach 1" which I prefer and the "Half wall approach" is so small that both can go along in one design without the player even recognizing.  I think it would be wise to stick to these approaches.
« Last Edit: August 16, 2017, 03:44:58 AM by Dinonykos »
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Offline Uatu

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Re: art requests for Dinonykos
« Reply #491 on: August 16, 2017, 07:58:23 AM »
Maybe that is why mine look different - according to my own pseudo-grids, I decided that the center of the party was behind the view, similar to the 3rd image (but not quite that far back).  My guess was based mainly on how I thought the perspective should work...
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Offline Dinonykos

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Re: art requests for Dinonykos
« Reply #492 on: August 16, 2017, 08:32:45 AM »
I guess depending on how you combine the different perspectives used, you can come to a lot of different results, which are all "correct". :) I did not want to imply that one approach is wrong.
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Offline manikus

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Re: art requests for Dinonykos
« Reply #493 on: August 16, 2017, 01:04:38 PM »
I didn't mention earlier, but even though I was already using the half-wall approach, when I made cameras so I could render walls, it ends up showing 51% of the side wall. 51% at the 176x211 is hard to tell from 50%, in fact I couldn't. But, I found this when making walls for the 528x528 viewport (1024x768 square wall). This is not mathematical proof, just that when I set up my cameras and turned them to capture the side-walls, that was what I got. :D

Honestly, I think that, excluding the full wall approach, all of the others work together just fine.

Also, thanks for the visual representation, Dinonykos. That makes what we are talking about very clear.

Offline Dinonykos

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Re: art requests for Dinonykos
« Reply #494 on: September 26, 2017, 02:40:56 PM »
For "Case of the stolen masterpiece", I turned one of Uatu's nice walls from grey to green. I have now made a "pair" of stairs for these walls. I will modify them later to fit with other walls of Uatu...
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