Author Topic: Upgrading Snow Tigress to DC 2.x/3.x  (Read 372 times)

Offline Dinonykos

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Upgrading Snow Tigress to DC 2.x/3.x
« on: August 09, 2017, 05:54:02 AM »
I have just tried transferring Snow Tigress from DC 0.914 to DC 3.x.

It seems the logic-block-based wall change thing which is so important for this design seems to generally work thanks to Paul's hint to add "UseWallIndex" to the Global Settings. There seem to be some issues concerning transfer modules. I assume that the "execute event after transfer" function does not work properly, but I will check that in detail

However, one thing that can probably easily be changed is that
a) Characters cannot equip items.
b) Combats do not work.
I guess this is related to the item and monster databases I tried to import. What do I have to do to import old items and monster databases into DC 2.x/3.x?

(In worst case, I could just manually change these databases...)
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Offline Paul R. Stevens

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Re: Upgrading Snow Tigress to DC 2.x/3.x
« Reply #1 on: August 09, 2017, 11:37:20 AM »
It is my hope that such upgrades should be
extremely painless.  And important.  The fact
that it does not happen automatically means that
I failed.

Let us (you, Manikus, and I) attempt to get this
to work by changing the editor only.  We can see
how far we can get before you make any changes to
the design.

I imagine we should start by my installing your
0.914 design, in it entirety, on my computer.  Can
you provide a link?

Offline Dinonykos

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Re: Upgrading Snow Tigress to DC 2.x/3.x
« Reply #2 on: August 09, 2017, 11:51:44 AM »
Dear Paul,

you can find the link here:
http://dhost.info/dinonykos/pagesnwt.html

I do not yet necessarily see that you failed. I have seen that the way the items and monster files work has changed a little (I think there was a warning message concerning this when importing the design), and maybe I just used a wrong procedure when transferring the item.txt and the monster.txt files to the updated design.
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Online manikus

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Re: Upgrading Snow Tigress to DC 2.x/3.x
« Reply #3 on: August 09, 2017, 12:35:42 PM »
You gents have my complete attention. :)

I have recentl converted a whole bunch of .914 designs to 3.02. All of the failures I have had are related to various database issues. I was able to re-import the databases and the problems resolved. All of them. One of these designs I updated was my own and I have been testing all the things that happen in it (because I am updating the art). No issues with events found, the caveat being that this design does not have any Logic Block events.

Dinonykos, did you import the new text versions of the database? DC only reads the .dat versions of the databases as far as play is concerned.

Paul, let me know what you need. Along this update line, thre were two games made in earlier versin of DC that I cannot update, one of which crashes the editor when I try. These are currently waiting in my queue of issues to bring up because we were working on the AVI issue (which when the paths are resolved will show you a CtD).

Offline Paul R. Stevens

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Re: Upgrading Snow Tigress to DC 2.x/3.x
« Reply #4 on: August 09, 2017, 01:22:50 PM »
Quote
re-import the databases and the problems resolved

I need to be sure I understand this.

What if I have a 0.914 design and I have made many
changes to my databases.  Are you saying that I
should 'import' the new databases that you supply?
Would I not lose all the modifications that I worked so
hard to produce?

Or do I misunderstand what you are saying?  Or....

Offline Dinonykos

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Re: Upgrading Snow Tigress to DC 2.x/3.x
« Reply #5 on: August 09, 2017, 01:27:36 PM »
I did the following:

I took several txt-files from another design ("Ambassador's Letter"), since these were modified versions of the newer databases, and imported them into the new design (races, baseclasses, classes, ability, config). I think this worked well. I had no "traits.txt" file, but I hope that is not a problem(?)...

I exported the monster and items files from the 0.914-version of Snow Tigress to text files, moved these files into the data folder of the 2.x-version of Snow Tigress, and imported them. I got messages that there are minor errors in the databases. 

I moved the AI-Script-BLK file (and bass.dll and sound.ini) into the data folder.
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Online manikus

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Re: Upgrading Snow Tigress to DC 2.x/3.x
« Reply #6 on: August 09, 2017, 01:37:04 PM »
There is a bit of a back end to this particular conversation - Dinonykos has updated databases for his design he made in 2.x.
You are right. if he used something I provided it would ruin his work.

In another thread, I had suggested to him and the rest that they export to text the databases that they have modified and then they will need to update and re-import. But, any database that they have not modified they can just use the ones I have provided with our default package. I think if there was some way to check if the designer had modified a database and if no, to use the one from TemplateDesign.dsn/Data folder, that would help a lot.

Online manikus

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Re: Upgrading Snow Tigress to DC 2.x/3.x
« Reply #7 on: August 09, 2017, 01:43:44 PM »
I did the following:

I exported the monster and items files from the 0.914-version of Snow Tigress to text files, moved these files into the data folder of the 2.x-version of Snow Tigress, and imported them. I got messages that there are minor errors in the databases. 

Not a surprise. Much has changed, including some keywords (plus the addition of some and the elimination of some).
Rename the .914 databases to something that lets you know they are the old ones. Convert your design and export the same database files to text. Open up an old one new one for the same database and you will see the main differences, but not all of the keywords for some databases.

Also, "traits" and "spellgroups" are no longer used by DC. I may be mis-recalling, but I don't think they were being used in .914 and earlier.

Offline Paul R. Stevens

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Re: Upgrading Snow Tigress to DC 2.x/3.x
« Reply #8 on: August 09, 2017, 02:43:05 PM »
Well, this is all very confusing to me.  Imagine what it must
be like to people who have not spent ten years writing the
DC editor and engine.

Quote from: Manikus
export to text the databases that they have modified and then they will need to update and re-import.

What does this mean "to update".  What needs to be done
and why is it necessary?  Why cannot the editor do this
automatically?  Is it very complicated?

===========**************===========
As chief programmer (by default) I would like to make this
conversion as automatic as possible.  Can we start with
Dinonykos' original design and start the conversion
process up until the first problem and see if that first
problem can be fixed?  If it cannot, so be it.  If it can, we
can proceed to the second problem.


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Re: Upgrading Snow Tigress to DC 2.x/3.x
« Reply #9 on: August 09, 2017, 03:55:25 PM »
Sounds good to me, Paul. And better yet, it sounds completely doable.

By "updating" I mean removing 'Key ID' if it is there, adding missing keywords , removing any extraneous keywords and if applicable changing any keywords.

In at least one case (the ability database), it actually will work as is, but has none of the bonuses or penalties for PC races.

Let me know what you need from me, and I will do what I can to make it happen. :D

Offline Paul R. Stevens

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Re: Upgrading Snow Tigress to DC 2.x/3.x
« Reply #10 on: August 09, 2017, 06:12:51 PM »
I will download Dinonykos' design and see how I fare
in an attempt to load it with the latest editor.

I faintly recall a version of the editor that was labeled
as the latest editor that could directly load older designs.
Something like "To convert an old (x.xx) design you first
load it with editor version y.yy, save it, and then you can load
it with the most recent editor.  May have been a nightmare.
But if anyone remembers such a thing, speak up!

Meanwhile, I have attacked the AVI-movie problem so that
we can get that out of our way.

Offline Paul R. Stevens

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Re: Upgrading Snow Tigress to DC 2.x/3.x
« Reply #11 on: August 09, 2017, 07:02:04 PM »
I downloaded SnowTigress.

I copied all resource files to 'Resources'.
I copied all data files to 'Data'.
I added engine version 3.05 to the design.

I loaded the design with editor 3.05 and answered
all the questions positively.  Ie: let it do whatever
it wants.  I saved the design in a new folder.

I played the design.  Added two characters.  Pressed
'Enter' about a hundred times, and got stuck in a room
where it says I need additional items to exit.

As far as I can tell, it works.  What we need is a
demonstration of something that fails.

The editor says something about editor version 0.998101.
Perhaps that is a magic editor version.  I don't have a copy
of that editor right at hand but I can probably find it in
a backup somewhere.

Offline Dinonykos

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Re: Upgrading Snow Tigress to DC 2.x/3.x
« Reply #12 on: August 10, 2017, 02:01:51 AM »
Hi Paul,

I guess this is the general problem that in such cases, some issues occur only later in game with certain types of events.

However, there is one problem you can encounter right after the (I admit) long introduction: The character Binjo has two items with her, which cannot be equipped (though they can in the 0.914 version). I guess that is related to the imported item file and the changes Manikus mentioned.

Sidenote: I think a completely automated transfer from 0.914 to 2.x/3.x cannot work in any case since the frame handling has been changed (for good reason). Thus the old frame graphics have to be changed to work in newer DC versions.
« Last Edit: August 10, 2017, 02:36:07 AM by Dinonykos »
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Offline Dinonykos

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Re: Upgrading Snow Tigress to DC 2.x/3.x
« Reply #13 on: August 10, 2017, 03:03:27 AM »
Perhaps this is more complicated than I thought.
To experiment a little, I saved the transferred design into a new folder.

The equip-problem is simply related to the classes. When I imported the items file, the information that the class "Ninja" can use Binjo's items was lost.

What confuses me now is that the midi music is not played. I added a lot of music to the design, but it is not played. (I checked that it's not because of my settings, midi files are played correctly in other designs.) I even loaded other music pieces, e.g. for the intro music, but it was not played. When I loaded a wav-file, it was played. Midi files are not even played within the editor.
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Offline Paul R. Stevens

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Re: Upgrading Snow Tigress to DC 2.x/3.x
« Reply #14 on: August 10, 2017, 09:25:30 AM »
Quote from: Dinonykos
When I imported the items file,

Stop!  Where are we?  I downloaded the design  from
your link (above).  I loaded it with the latest editor.
I did not 'import' an items file.  Why did you do that?

I thought we are trying to 'convert' an old design,
not 'upgrade' it.  What is happening here?  Manikus, help!
« Last Edit: August 10, 2017, 09:27:27 AM by Paul R. Stevens »

 

anything