Author Topic: Problems with my old Module  (Read 18884 times)

Offline Ben J

  • Keeper of the 44 quest variables
  • Dungeon Craft Tester
  • Hero Member
  • ***
  • Posts: 2723
  • "See how I reward those who fail me!"
Re: Problems with my old Module
« Reply #30 on: May 14, 2009, 03:15:08 PM »
Rest events do not display pictures!
I thought this would be a problem of version 1.0, but I just tested it in 1.2 and the problem is still there. The game says the city watch interrupts your rest, but you can't see the city watch. Is there a way to fix this?

Also, I just encountered a bug I've never noticed before: In my test dungeon, I created an "Add NPC" event that was set to "always happens". Right next to it, there's a trap that kills your active character. Vala dies. Step back onto the "Add NPC" event, and another Vala joins your party! Do this several times and you'll have a party full of dead Valas.
Released designs:

The Sect

Offline ProphetSword

  • Mod Designer
  • Administrator
  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 2968
  • FRUA Lives!
    • Lands of Adventure
Re: Problems with my old Module
« Reply #31 on: May 14, 2009, 05:11:26 PM »
Rest events do not display pictures!
I thought this would be a problem of version 1.0, but I just tested it in 1.2 and the problem is still there. The game says the city watch interrupts your rest, but you can't see the city watch. Is there a way to fix this?

This is a known problem.  You can find a list of known issues listed somewhere in the FAQ section of the Forum (and if not, I need to track it down and post it there).

The workaround is to insert another event before that one that also shows a bigpic.  A TEXT STATEMENT with a bigpic and no text is what most people use.

It would look like this:

TEXT STATEMENT:
BIGPIC - (Whatever you choose, it will flash by quickly...you may not even notice it).

Link it to:

TEXT STATEMENT:
PIC - Guard Pic
Text: "Guards interrupt your sleep."


Something like that.


Quote
Also, I just encountered a bug I've never noticed before: In my test dungeon, I created an "Add NPC" event that was set to "always happens". Right next to it, there's a trap that kills your active character. Vala dies. Step back onto the "Add NPC" event, and another Vala joins your party! Do this several times and you'll have a party full of dead Valas.

Haha...well, I don't think people generally use "Add NPC" with an "always happens" tag.  And unless you have a specific reason why you're doing it, you probably shouldn't either.
LANDS OF ADVENTURE: An Old-School Style CRPG

More Information Here: http://landsadventure.blogspot.com/

Offline Olivier Leroux

  • Administrator
  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 2345
  • Yip, yip, yip!
Re: Problems with my old Module
« Reply #32 on: May 14, 2009, 06:14:45 PM »
Rest events do not display pictures!
I thought this would be a problem of version 1.0, but I just tested it in 1.2 and the problem is still there. The game says the city watch interrupts your rest, but you can't see the city watch. Is there a way to fix this?

The workaround is to insert another event before that one that also shows a bigpic.  A TEXT STATEMENT with a bigpic and no text is what most people use.

It would look like this:

TEXT STATEMENT:
BIGPIC - (Whatever you choose, it will flash by quickly...you may not even notice it).

Or use a blank sprite pic. That way you won't see any unwanted picture flashing by, even if you've got good eyesight and quick perception. I'm not really sure if your problem is the same one as the bigpic problem, since I have never worked with rest events, but I guess you'll soon find out following Ben's instructions. Of course, the disadvantage, once again, is that you need to use more events...


Also, I just encountered a bug I've never noticed before: In my test dungeon, I created an "Add NPC" event that was set to "always happens". Right next to it, there's a trap that kills your active character. Vala dies. Step back onto the "Add NPC" event, and another Vala joins your party! Do this several times and you'll have a party full of dead Valas.

Haha...well, I don't think people generally use "Add NPC" with an "always happens" tag.  And unless you have a specific reason why you're doing it, you probably shouldn't either.

:D But I wonder if it would be possible for a designer to creatively exploit this bug in any way... Hm.

Offline Ben J

  • Keeper of the 44 quest variables
  • Dungeon Craft Tester
  • Hero Member
  • ***
  • Posts: 2723
  • "See how I reward those who fail me!"
Re: Problems with my old Module
« Reply #33 on: May 14, 2009, 06:27:03 PM »
Quote
The workaround is to insert another event before that one that also shows a bigpic.  A TEXT STATEMENT with a bigpic and no text is what most people use.

It would look like this:

TEXT STATEMENT:
BIGPIC - (Whatever you choose, it will flash by quickly...you may not even notice it).
Just tested it and it works great. Thank you! This was a problem that has always bothered me.

Only problem is, I have to free some events from the iron grasp of the game to use as rest-bigpic-events.  ;D

For the pic, I simply killed one of the unused overland maps by importing the bigpic template into its spot. This way there won't be a flash of another picture there, just gray.

I had an unused map because, contrary to what I said before, i still found some pics that even my game, with all the suspension of disbelief it required, could find no use for, not even in the zoo (which housed some of the more curious pics). What's the point of the sea dragon pic, for example? You can't use it for combat, because the sea dragon was not available as a monster in the original UA, and you can't use it on a text event because it won't animate...  ::)
There were several such odd picture choices in the library... monster pics without a combat icon, combat icons without a monster picture, etc.

Another question: Why does the music sound different in version 1.2? Sounds like MIDI since I updated the program. Liked it slightly better before.

By the way, I have started to translate the game now. Runs smoothly so far. Some odd things. Events still retain their german names in the editor: "Textstelle", "Kampf" etc. ... My favourite was "Frage Ebene" for "Quest stage". Translates as "Question Level". Didn't make any sense at all.

I'm glad the items and preset event texts do translate into english. Otherwise, I would have had to hack everything just to translate the game.
Released designs:

The Sect

Offline ProphetSword

  • Mod Designer
  • Administrator
  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 2968
  • FRUA Lives!
    • Lands of Adventure
Re: Problems with my old Module
« Reply #34 on: May 14, 2009, 09:58:07 PM »
Just tested it and it works great. Thank you! This was a problem that has always bothered me.

That's what we're here for.  You might try the sprite option that Olivier suggested.  I always went for the bigpic myself.

Quote
What's the point of the sea dragon pic, for example? You can't use it for combat, because the sea dragon was not available as a monster in the original UA, and you can't use it on a text event because it won't animate...  ::)

I'm not sure why they didn't include it in UA (probably ran out of time...I have said many times that the whole thing seems thrown together very fast using a modified "Dark Queen of Krynn" engine). 

The good news is that the icon is available now.  Has been for many years.  You just have to download and import it.

As for animating it, I think all you have to do is insert it into any event that will animate just prior to the text event that you want it to appear.  I usually use the "Gain Experience" event, use the animated picture, and give the highlighted party member 1 XP (you have to award at least 1 XP with that event).

If you follow that with a text event that has no pic listed, I believe you will end up with an animated picture in your text event.
 
Quote
There were several such odd picture choices in the library... monster pics without a combat icon, combat icons without a monster picture, etc.

Yeah, but this is no longer an issue.  After 16 years, we've accumulated a lot of artwork and combat icons.

Quote
Another question: Why does the music sound different in version 1.2? Sounds like MIDI since I updated the program. Liked it slightly better before.

You might try running the "Install" program and see if you can change it.

Or, if you installed the instr.ad file into your module directory, that could be what it is as well.
LANDS OF ADVENTURE: An Old-School Style CRPG

More Information Here: http://landsadventure.blogspot.com/

Offline Olivier Leroux

  • Administrator
  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 2345
  • Yip, yip, yip!
Re: Problems with my old Module
« Reply #35 on: May 15, 2009, 06:18:05 AM »
"Textstelle" ... "Frage Ebene"

 :D

Offline DesertScrb

  • Sr. Member
  • ****
  • Posts: 266
  • Another day, another dungeon.
    • Super Galactic Dreadnought blog
Re: Problems with my old Module
« Reply #36 on: May 15, 2009, 08:28:29 AM »
What's the point of the sea dragon pic, for example? You can't use it for combat, because the sea dragon was not available as a monster in the original UA, and you can't use it on a text event because it won't animate...  ::)

There is a fix to get those animated pics to work with text and other events that don't animate in default UA--you just have to change one byte in CKIT.  This article has the details.

Offline Ben J

  • Keeper of the 44 quest variables
  • Dungeon Craft Tester
  • Hero Member
  • ***
  • Posts: 2723
  • "See how I reward those who fail me!"
Re: Problems with my old Module
« Reply #37 on: May 15, 2009, 11:38:48 AM »
Quote from: ProphetSword
You might try running the "Install" program and see if you can change it.

That's where I looked first, but the install program still said "soundblaster for music & effects". But actually, the game has it mixed up now: I had to choose "adlib for music, pc speaker for sounds" to get my old soundblaster music back, while the soundblaster option now gives me the MIDI-sounding music and extremely annoying PC-speaker-effects. Weird. But it works now.

Quote
As for animating it, I think all you have to do is insert it into any event that will animate just prior to the text event that you want it to appear.  I usually use the "Gain Experience" event, use the animated picture, and give the highlighted party member 1 XP (you have to award at least 1 XP with that event).

If you follow that with a text event that has no pic listed, I believe you will end up with an animated picture in your text event.
Never thought of that. Cool. In my next game, when I need an animation to work  I will try this, or DesertScrbs method.

In my game, I actually exploited the non-animation bug at some points. The drider, for example, was not a drider but something else, I think it was the puniest creature in the world, you could see it in the zoo. ;)

Quote
I'm not sure why they didn't include it in UA (probably ran out of time...I have said many times that the whole thing seems thrown together very fast using a modified "Dark Queen of Krynn" engine).
And on top of this, the German version had been very sloppily translated.

Quote from: Olivier Leroux
I'm not really sure if your problem is the same one as the bigpic problem, since I have never worked with rest events
Do you always use "no rest" zones instead?
Released designs:

The Sect

Offline Olivier Leroux

  • Administrator
  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 2345
  • Yip, yip, yip!
Re: Problems with my old Module
« Reply #38 on: May 15, 2009, 02:31:20 PM »
Quote from: Olivier Leroux
I'm not really sure if your problem is the same one as the bigpic problem, since I have never worked with rest events
Do you always use "no rest" zones instead?

"Always" sounds so routine, seeing that I only ever released two short and fragmentary mods, while most of the time I just play around with graphics and ideas and never really get to the point where I have to think about rest events or "no rest" zones.  :D

But I think in those two mods I didn't allow resting except in safe spots. So it was either no rest or no risk at all. I might have used rest events along the lines of "You awake from bad dreams" or "You can't get to sleep, it's too noisy", just short messages to interrupt resting and tell the players that this isn't the right spot to rest, but always without pictures. I'd probably do it like that again, because generally I'm no big friend of random combats and rest attacks. Although you could certainly be creative with rest events, too. Hm...

^ suddenly wakes to find his chuckling companions bending over him. A quick look into his mirror shield reveals the damage done. "Ye bastards, what did ye do to me beard?!?"  ;D

Offline Ben J

  • Keeper of the 44 quest variables
  • Dungeon Craft Tester
  • Hero Member
  • ***
  • Posts: 2723
  • "See how I reward those who fail me!"
Re: Problems with my old Module
« Reply #39 on: May 20, 2009, 04:16:58 AM »
I just realized that, in German UA, the option "additional dificulty in turning undead" was translated as "chance to resurrect the dead". And "100 (impossible)" was translated to "100 (possible)"...  >:(
And I always set the option to "100", because I wanted to make sure that the player would be able to resurrect the dead party members after the fight....  :-\

Another reason why I have decided to abandon the German version altogether. It's beyond repair. English version is now the "official release". :D

Quote from: Olivier Leroux
But I think in those two mods I didn't allow resting except in safe spots. So it was either no rest or no risk at all.
The downside to this is that the player is unable to use the "fix" command, except in safe spots.
Released designs:

The Sect

Offline Olivier Leroux

  • Administrator
  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 2345
  • Yip, yip, yip!
Re: Problems with my old Module
« Reply #40 on: May 20, 2009, 08:56:39 AM »
Quote from: Olivier Leroux
But I think in those two mods I didn't allow resting except in safe spots. So it was either no rest or no risk at all.
The downside to this is that the player is unable to use the "fix" command, except in safe spots.

That's true, but as far as I understand the "fix" command that would be perfectly reasonable. I think fixing is far more powerful than just casting all memorized healing spells. It's assuming the clerics can cast, memorize, cast, memorize, cast etc. until every injury is fixed - if you do that manually in an area that's not safe you'd run the risk of rest encounters. So actually the possibility to fix without risk in an area that's not safe somehow feels like cheating to me.

Of course my method - well, it's not really mine, I borrowed it from the designs of Ray Dyer, Darius Whiteheart, Kaz Keith, I think Ben Sanderfer etc. - anyway, this method requires a good spread of safe spots and a good supply of healing potions but makes the game challenging and interesting if done right. I admit that your method has its advantages too. If resting is mostly necessary for memorizing mage spells only and fixing allows the party to reduce the threat of rest encounters, I wouldn't be that annoyed by them either.  :)

In any case, I like lots of different play and designing styles.

Offline ProphetSword

  • Mod Designer
  • Administrator
  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 2968
  • FRUA Lives!
    • Lands of Adventure
Re: Problems with my old Module
« Reply #41 on: May 20, 2009, 09:30:28 AM »
Of course my method - well, it's not really mine, I borrowed it from the designs of Ray Dyer, Darius Whiteheart, Kaz Keith, I think Ben Sanderfer etc. - anyway, this method requires a good spread of safe spots and a good supply of healing potions but makes the game challenging and interesting if done right. I admit that your method has its advantages too. If resting is mostly necessary for memorizing mage spells only and fixing allows the party to reduce the threat of rest encounters, I wouldn't be that annoyed by them either.  :)

Actually, I think most of my designs allow the party to rest at any time (unless in cities), but there's a chance they'll trigger an encounter if they rest in a dangerous area.

Also, I thought using "Fix" in a place where you could trigger resting encounters would cause them to trigger sometimes too (since "memorizing" is part of the equation).  I could be wrong about that.
LANDS OF ADVENTURE: An Old-School Style CRPG

More Information Here: http://landsadventure.blogspot.com/

Offline Olivier Leroux

  • Administrator
  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 2345
  • Yip, yip, yip!
Re: Problems with my old Module
« Reply #42 on: May 20, 2009, 01:41:51 PM »
Actually, I think most of my designs allow the party to rest at any time (unless in cities), but there's a chance they'll trigger an encounter if they rest in a dangerous area.

Ah, ok. I wasn't too sure about your designs myself. But I'm certain at least one of the other three designers favors this method, and I just imitated them.  ;D

Offline Ben J

  • Keeper of the 44 quest variables
  • Dungeon Craft Tester
  • Hero Member
  • ***
  • Posts: 2723
  • "See how I reward those who fail me!"
Re: Problems with my old Module
« Reply #43 on: May 20, 2009, 03:10:34 PM »
Quote from: ProphetSword
Also, I thought using "Fix" in a place where you could trigger resting encounters would cause them to trigger sometimes too (since "memorizing" is part of the equation).  I could be wrong about that.
Yes, the "fix" command also triggers the rest events, depending of how long the "fixing" would take.

Quote from: Olivier Leroux
That's true, but as far as I understand the "fix" command that would be perfectly reasonable. I think fixing is far more powerful than just casting all memorized healing spells. It's assuming the clerics can cast, memorize, cast, memorize, cast etc. until every injury is fixed - if you do that manually in an area that's not safe you'd run the risk of rest encounters.
I think the "fix" command is good because it saves the player the time to do repetitive things over and over again, like casting healing spells manually. Right now, I'm re-playing the original Pool of Radiance for a bit, and I really miss the quick fix command.
Apart from that, "fix" does not really reduce the risk of encounters.

But not allowing the player to rest where he wants to takes a bit of freedom away from the player. Also, if you can only rest in "safe spots", it actually makes the game easier in my opinion, since you are simply not allowed to rest in a dangerous place, you cannot even attempt it. You'll always know that nothing will happen to you in any area that allows you to rest.
Released designs:

The Sect

Offline Olivier Leroux

  • Administrator
  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 2345
  • Yip, yip, yip!
Re: Problems with my old Module
« Reply #44 on: May 20, 2009, 04:50:56 PM »
Also, if you can only rest in "safe spots", it actually makes the game easier in my opinion, since you are simply not allowed to rest in a dangerous place, you cannot even attempt it. You'll always know that nothing will happen to you in any area that allows you to rest.

Hm, so maybe that's really the reason I like this method better...  :D

Nevermind. It seems I was wrong about the "Fix" command anyway (and it's not as if I don't appreciate it in general). :)