Author Topic: Platinum to Gold and No XP for Treasure  (Read 3023 times)

Offline Vix

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Platinum to Gold and No XP for Treasure
« on: February 04, 2009, 12:24:15 PM »
I know there was a way to hack this, as Ray Dyer's Realm and the GHRUA also did this. My question is, how do you do it? Is there a premade diff entry that can be slipped into an existing diff.tbl? I have a;ways hated the platinum standard in UA.

Also ...

I know I can remove the experience rewards from plussed items and gems/jewels, but does it remove it for other magic items such as potions, scrolls, wands, etc? And, is there a way to hack out the experience reward gained on coin treasure reliably?

I prefer to be in full control over the XP gain through encounters, quest rewards, and the like, rather than having to factor in treasure XP, too.

jvarnes

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Re: Platinum to Gold and No XP for Treasure
« Reply #1 on: February 17, 2009, 12:54:33 AM »
Hi Vix,

I was hoping someone with more knowledge might chime in on this question... but alas...

I was never able to find the XP reward for platinum. Just the ones you mentioned above (yeah I made it into the hackdocs! :D), but I may revisit that area again and look for entries of "2" (since you get 2 xp per platinum piece)

In testing magic items out it indeed looks like all that one magic multiplier pointer will zero out ALL magic items XP rewards (even rings, potions, gauntlets of ogre power etc.). I created a simple test dungeon tonight where I set out various items via "Give Treasure" and none of them gave XP when hacked... BUT I did not test to see if any XP was given after identifying or wearing items like rings, etc.
(although in my unhacked dry run unidentified vorpal swords & gauntlets of ogre power gave plenty of XP anyways - kind of a dead giveaway to my fighter when he pick it up heh)

I guess more testing needs to be done, but at least it *appears* you can gain some control over treasure XP.

Hope this helps!

PS - Incidently the relative lines to add to a diff.tbl to "zero out" the 3 above mentioned XP rewards (gems, jewels, and magic items) are:

4BA7A FA 0
4BA91 98 0
4BA92 8 0
4BABA 90 0
4BABB 1 0

jvarnes

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Re: Platinum to Gold and No XP for Treasure
« Reply #2 on: February 17, 2009, 02:11:33 AM »
Edit -

Well I didn't find the platinum XP yet, but I did accidently break something with this line:

4BA80 0 1

Basically it always returns 0 XP for all kinds of treasure (including coins). "Give Experience" seems to work correctly. I did not test XP from combat to be sure that works, but I assume it would. My accidental hack looks like it just mucks up the computation to return amount of XP when party finds treasure (probably changes the relation check or some-such techno-babble...). ALso don't know if this applies to Combat Treasure as well (since I only tested Give Treasure of varying kinds and amounts)

So in essence I think this will do what you want, but I confess that I have no idea if it will cause something unforseen later on.

I need a real hacker to look at offset 309888 and the surrounding bytes and see what I am stomping on here by changing this.   ???

Any takers??

Offline Vix

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Re: Platinum to Gold and No XP for Treasure
« Reply #3 on: February 17, 2009, 07:45:59 AM »
HackCKIT allows the removal of XP rewards for magic items, I have been told.

Looks like you spent some time mucking around with the code. Thanks. You may be onto something there.

jvarnes

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Re: Platinum to Gold and No XP for Treasure
« Reply #4 on: February 18, 2009, 01:35:51 PM »
Well I lied  :-\

I tested this some more (the diff table entry above) and it DOES prevent experience from fights as well as treasure. In other words you do not get experience from anything EXCEPT the Give Experience event so... it's just not useful to what you want to do.
(plus I don't really know what else it's breaking... for example I didn't test to see if you could still level up when you acquire enough experience.)

Sadly the relevant byte for Platinum experience isn't obvious (checked all the 1s and 2s in that area) or it's just not in the immediate vicinity of the other three (gems, jewels, magic)

I might revisit this in the future, but not until I have read everything I can about byte editing in FRUA so I can wrap my head around jump pointers, push values, offsets, etc. etc. so I can identify sections of code better and know what I'm breaking when I break it haha  :D

PS - Incidentally even in "Vanilla" UA (BTW I coined that phrase six or seven years ago on the mailing list!) the magic rings such as Wizardry, Invisibility, etc. do not give any XP. I need to break out the item editor and see if this a bug in the items or the engine (although like you I prefer not to give XP for items)

Offline Vix

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Re: Platinum to Gold and No XP for Treasure
« Reply #5 on: February 18, 2009, 01:46:02 PM »
Thanks for all the work looking for it. I suppose I can just give the coins as rewards and not found treasure. Or .. hmm, better yet ... hack the items to make trade bars and the like (as I wrote an article on years ago) anjd give those in the monster loot tables. Then players could go sell them, then buy what they want. A little cumbersome but honestly ... why would kobolds and orcs have gold (or platinum) coins?

Sure, some might be from people they have waylaid and killed. And I suppose they could use them as trade with unscrupulous others ... but it is not like they are sauntering into town to buy things with them. Seems to me it would make more sense for them to melt them down to ingots and the like for trading.

plus, I can assign low weight to them so people don't get encumbered with coin weight. Unless they go sell them all, of course. muahaha

Offline ProphetSword

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Re: Platinum to Gold and No XP for Treasure
« Reply #6 on: February 18, 2009, 02:31:38 PM »
Alternately, you could turn off the XP gain, and award the XP you want at the end of each combat, with a message that says something like:

"For defeating the kobolds, the party gains 75 xp!"


This would give you full control over all the XP gained in the module, providing turning it off doesn't break something else.
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jvarnes

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Re: Platinum to Gold and No XP for Treasure
« Reply #7 on: February 18, 2009, 02:52:29 PM »
Good ideas there Vix.

If you have the strings and items available you could even do something generic like:

  • Pouch of 10
  • Bag of 50
  • Sack of 100
  • Silver (which is already in the item vocab)
  • Copper
  • Gold
  • Platinum
  • Bar (for Gold Bar, Silver Bar, etc.)
  • Nugget

Then you can have fun making up various bags of loot! (you can even be mean and include "cursed" treasure like Fools Gold and Lead Bars :D)

Note you still have to do something with hacking the Plat text to Gold because the PCs will be getting cash from the shops which will go into that party Platinum pool...

jvarnes

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Re: Platinum to Gold and No XP for Treasure
« Reply #8 on: February 18, 2009, 02:58:39 PM »
Alternately, you could turn off the XP gain, and award the XP you want at the end of each combat, with a message that says something like:

"For defeating the kobolds, the party gains 75 xp!"


This would give you full control over all the XP gained in the module, providing turning it off doesn't break something else.

Yup that would work. Provided like you pointed out that my hack doesn't do something sinister like kill level progression  :-X

I would like this level of control myself, but you would have to use the hack that lets you see if the party defeated the monsters or ran away (so as not to get free XP):

Thief: It's a Basilisk! Run!
Fighter: Why do the cowards in our party always level up so quickly???
« Last Edit: February 18, 2009, 03:00:17 PM by jvarnes »

Offline ProphetSword

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Re: Platinum to Gold and No XP for Treasure
« Reply #9 on: February 18, 2009, 04:00:43 PM »
Well, one could argue that the thief, in this case, was smart.  I mean, he learned to run away from big bad monsters that might kill him.  I'd call that on the job experience!  ;D
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Offline Nol Drek

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Re: Platinum to Gold and No XP for Treasure
« Reply #10 on: February 18, 2009, 08:04:25 PM »
This could be a new Prestige Class.


Thief (Coward) Table I

Experience Points Level Level Title
      0-1,250      1    Chicken
  1,251-2,500      2    Yellow-Belly
  2,501-5,000      3    Sissy
  5,001-10,000     4    Milksop
 10,001-20,000     5    Craven
 20,001-42,500     6    Dastard
 42,501-70,000     7    Poltroon
 70,001-110,000    8    Cur
110,001-160,000    9    Caitiff
160,001-220,000   10    Coward
220,001-440,000   11    Wimp
440,001-660,000   12    Master Wimp
"Into the Drachensgrab Mountains!"

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Offline Vix

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Re: Platinum to Gold and No XP for Treasure
« Reply #11 on: February 18, 2009, 08:06:50 PM »
I LOL'd

Offline ProphetSword

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Re: Platinum to Gold and No XP for Treasure
« Reply #12 on: February 18, 2009, 09:58:32 PM »
Yellow-Belly!  That's hilarious.
LANDS OF ADVENTURE: An Old-School Style CRPG

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jvarnes

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Re: Platinum to Gold and No XP for Treasure
« Reply #13 on: February 18, 2009, 10:53:18 PM »
And in another case of me re-inventing the wheel... this comes from an article by David Knott in UANL #27:

"Here is a possible lead for the platinum XP value:

Offset 309866 has a default value of 1.  Changing it to a value of 0 has no effect.  Changing it to a value of 2+ causes platinum to have no XP value. Changing it to a value of 254-255 (-1 or less?) causes 100 PP to have a value of 1 XP.  I did all my tests with a default treasure value of 100 PPs. I also experimented with changing offset 309865 between 210 and 211, with no noticeable effects.  If anyone can figure out what I have been doing with those bytes, please let me know."

So David was right in the same area as I was looking for the same thing.
Note he may have done even LESS testing than I did so buyer beware...

PS - the releveant lines to add to a diff.tbl would be:

4BA6A 1 2

(for no XP)

- OR -

4BA6A 1 FF

(for that weird 100 PP = 1 XP thing he describes)

If I get a chance I'll try testing the first one and see if it affects combat XP and / or any other XP...

PSS - Level 13+ Grand Master Wussy Boy

jvarnes

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Re: Platinum to Gold and No XP for Treasure
« Reply #14 on: February 18, 2009, 11:06:45 PM »
Well I couldn't wait so I took my hacks out and put in Davids 0 XP one and ran through all the various events in my test module and it seemed to work perfectly!

Adding "4BA6A 1 2" took out XP for Platinum, but still allowed XP from gems, jewelry, magic items, combat & give experience. When enough experience was given to go up a level the characters name changed color and he was able to level up.

The only other thing to do now is a full test in a real module. Want to be a guinea pig Vix?

Well here are the lines to create (or add to) a diff.tbl to zero out XP for gems, jewelry, magic & coin (but still allow combat and give experience):

4BA6A 1 2
4BA7A FA 0
4BA91 98 0
4BA92 8 0
4BABA 90 0
4BABB 1 0

 

anything